Skill Calculator?

FluffyMittensFluffyMittens Posts: 118
edited April 2012 in TL2 General Discussions
Hey Runic, any chance that you guys could put out a skill calculator sometime before the release, or even after? I love playing with calculators looking at all the different possible builds I can make. Just wondering :D
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Comments

  • gold163gold163 Posts: 4,852
    I don't think that's really something that Runic plans on doing. It's possible, but more often than not in my experience it's the players who put that kind of stuff together, so we probably won't see something like that until after the game's release, and it'll come from the fans.
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  • Yea that makes sense. But im still hoping. My idea is that I could look at how good skills get before having to waste points in them in the actual game. Since there is going to be no respec option there is nothing more frustrating than investing levels worth of points into a skill which in the end is useless or not as good as others and becomes a waste. In games like this that offer no way of fixing mistakes I find it extremely easy to mess up a character and have to start all over again. That is prolly my biggest concern for T2. Being punished for not knowing which skills are better or which ones I will even like and want to use. I really hope they include a way to avoid this. Because this one thing has made me completely quit playing certain games before in the past.
  • xanixani Posts: 583
    Someone will do respec mod, dont worry ;)
  • KalstenKalsten Posts: 107
    xani wrote:
    Someone will do respec mod, dont worry ;)

    Respec mod is a must have in any game. I don't understand why is not available in most of them, or when it is, is freakinly expensive. I mean, I like to try things, and not to be worried if I put some points in a bad skill in a character that I will never be able to change. I love to have the Respec mod in Torchlight.
  • Im all for a respec mod, but my concern there is that once you use a mod on any character you permanently "dirty" that character which makes it so you can no longer play on the vanilla servers. At least from my understanding. While im not against mods or anything I do prefer to just play vanilla. The way the developers designed it. So thats why im hoping there will be some kind of respec option or at least a skill calculator before release so that I can see how I want to build my characters without having to make a "test" character and without having to use any mods.
  • pothbpothb Posts: 220
    Not in Diablo 3!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    .... .... ... or at least that's their argument for their new skill system.
  • amb2010amb2010 Posts: 2,946
    So then lets not turn this into another "Respec vs No Respec" thread. :lol:

    To answer your question, I doubt it. The skills aren't something really set in stone and a company like Blizzard can afford to have people sit down program the skill calculate and maintain/update it every time they make a change so they're okay with taking time to do it. Runic however is pretty small and I'd much rather have them all working on the game instead of something like this.
    luufx.png
    Disclaimer: Above berating does not apply to those with a brain (usually).
  • jamesLjamesL Posts: 3,568
    I doubt all the skills will be finalized until a week before launch anyway
    I don't have a sig
  • Yea thats true. I would rather them work on the game then a skill calculator. But im still hoping for a way around what I mentioned before without having to use mods because if at all possible I would like to keep my characters vanilla. Or at least my main characters. But idk maybe I will just have to **** it up and waste 30+ hours making a test character to see which skills i like and are good =/
  • PicklePickle Posts: 4
    Assuming I can extract the necessary data from the game, I intend to make a skill calculator (among other things) for Torchlight 2. This is also assuming Torchlight 2 actually comes out before I die of old age.
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    yeah, I wanted to see the skills aswell, to see if they changed anything from TL1, or at it compares to other hack'n slash.
    I did one myself for D3: http://syl.comli.com/d3/
  • cool syl. Im planning on rolling a barbarian as my first character too. Not sure what build im gonna go with though. I will have to play with the skills and what not. Thats one thing im loving about D3. The unique approach to skills and builds. I like the idea of being able to play with different builds and styles without having to fully dedicate yourself to a specific build for the entire game. It allows you to adapt to certain situations as well as experiment with obscure builds without being penalized. Also the augmenting of skills is a very cool feature that I hope more arpgs do in the future.
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    I will certainly start with a barb as well. I have a few builds on my own, ready to roll :p
    http://syl.comli.com/d3/?barbarian#bZSViP!ZYd!ZZZZYc
    http://syl.comli.com/d3/?barbarian#aeVXkR!bUc!bcaaba
    http://syl.comli.com/d3/?barbarian#bcgVQR!gVX!YZYcbc

    And I agree with you, I love the fact you have a few skills to try each time you level up, and there seems to be a good amount of synergies.
  • Yea I also love how they handle the skills and resources. I love that there are actually cool effective skills that dont cost a thing to use. Like bash and cleave and what not. I think its sick. You can basically just spam your generators then unleash even more powerful abilities once you have collected some fury or whatever. I love the system and the sense of scale in the game is unlike anything I have seen. Everything in the game just makes you seem so freaking badass. Oh man Im getting excited just talking about it. I better stop before im banned haha.
  • kaosweilderkaosweilder Posts: 651
    Didn't someone say that he will make Skill Calc when game comes out. Maybe it was FrostyNinja, maybe Webb. I don't remember exactly. Age is messing up my memories :lol:
  • OmnifasOmnifas Posts: 3,442 ✭✭✭
    RGF a while ago, Frosty recently as a possibility.
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    Do Runic not share information about this because they want to keep it a surprise? Or because it isn't ready?
  • amb2010amb2010 Posts: 2,946
    They spend a vast majority of the development cycle, even all the way up to a few days till release, fine tuning and changing the skills so it's not so much because they want to surprise us but becase they just don't have the skills in a state that warrants showing them to the public.

    (at least that's how it was with TL1 so *shrug*)
    luufx.png
    Disclaimer: Above berating does not apply to those with a brain (usually).
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    ok...
    I wanted to see if the skill tree changed since TL1.
    There were things I didn't like, and I wanted to see if they improved it.

    I didn't like the shared skills, I think it killed a bit the replay value of the game because I was thinking "why would I play this class when this one has the same skills?..."
    I hope they will really be unique this time.
  • DarkTailsDarkTails Posts: 4,148
    ...you can change your stats using the console.
  • FrostyNinjaFrostyNinja Posts: 197
    Hey Runic, any chance that you guys could put out a skill calculator sometime before the release, or even after? I love playing with calculators looking at all the different possible builds I can make. Just wondering :D
    If, by any chance, I round up being in the beta, I'll make sure to put one up on my site as soon as possible.
    L5cCH.png
  • TeppecTeppec Posts: 32
    Please understand. This is a game being made by a team of maybe 30 people or so.

    Let them focus on making the greatest ARPG ever :) They are already working hard, doing lots of nights and weekends.

    Skill calc is fun for a few hours, but I'm sure we'll live without it.
  • WebbstreWebbstre Posts: 7,221 ✭✭✭
    Once the beta is out we'll have one up on RGF as well. Taylor Balbi (who made the original one on the old Torchlight Insider site) whipped up the code for us. It's just waiting for data now. Precious, precious data...
    Administrator/Former Owner of Runic Games Fansite. Be sure to visit RGF for all your Torchlight series needs![/color] Don't forget to check out ModDrop as a one stop solution for installing and sharing mods easily!
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    nice, can't wait to see it :)
  • RustyRusty Posts: 1,640
    The calculators are super helpful, especially for those who feel like it is a waste to throw points into something and then realize it didn't help in the long run. It can also take away the need to respec so much. Glad you will host this.
  • From what I have seen syl all the skills are unique. But that brings me to another question I have about the skills. Alot of the skills i have seen seem to base their damage off of fixed damage associated with the level of that skill. The problem I have with this is that sooner or later as you keep playing you will reach the point where the monsters keep getting stronger but your skills dont because they are already maxed. After a while those types of skills soon become useless. This worries me with what I have seen with the skills so far because a lot of them have fixed damage like that but also the ones that are based off of your characters dps are extremely low like 20%. My worries is that if they dont somehow change or adjust how the skills scale that late into the game or maybe on playthrough 2 all your skills will slowly become too weak forcing you to rely mostly on your standard attack which we all know cant get you very far on higher difficulties. This was kind of a problem in T1. Some of the skills were too weak in the end because they were already maxed with no way to increase there damage or effectiveness as the enemies grew stronger.
  • xanixani Posts: 583
    There are problems with both ways:
    * If you have % of DPS as skill, you have to increase it with skill points and if you have 15 skill points it's hard to balance "low end" in a way that adding more than one point feels worthwhile
    If "magic missile" have 100% of weap. dmg and each point adds 10% (so at end its 250% weap. DPS).. why player would want to use more than 1 point ? put one point and put rest in passives

    * If you do flat dmg, hard to scale at high end, also builds heavily focused on spamming skills it encourages to completely ignore offensive stats and just build defense and get all DPS from skills

    The best would be probably both, some static dmg + 10% of DPS or sth like that

    D3 doesn't have that problem because skills in D3 does not have levels so they can just use pure %
    But tbh I'd wait for more info, skills could change A LOT since last runic event
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    @FluffyMittens: I think missed the fact that skill damage is based on a % of weapon damage.
    it means you skill damage scales with your weapon damage, the better weapon you get, the more damage your skill does.
  • Hmm yea thats true. Now that you mention it most of the skills did have both. That does seem to be the best route for skills which can be leveled. But still games in the past that had skills which relied entirely on static damage modifiers which scaled with levels became somewhat obsolete near the end of the game or second playthrough. Im really hoping this doesnt happen in T2. But honestly i have faith in runic. They seem to have come a very long ways since the days of T1 and I think they know what their doing with the skills. Also the info I was looking at was pretty dang old and I highly doubt that its the same any more.
  • SylSyl Posts: 104
    Agreed, that's why they changed it.
    Now you can use a 2H sword with your wizard and deal some nice damage ^^
    Attack speed also has an impact on skills, I don't know if it works with channeled skills though.
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