Dexterity and ranged magic spells

IldamosIldamos Posts: 70
edited August 2012 in Alchemist Discussions
Does increasing dexterity matter with ranged magic spells? Or are these affected solely by the Magic attribute?

Thanks!

Also: do area effect spells harm you summons?

Comments

  • ArkhamArkham Posts: 3,295 ✭✭✭
    Dexterity in TL1 is solely a ranged physical damage attribute (i.e. for guns, bows, etc.). Has no effect on magic spells.

    Your own AOE spells should not affect pets/minions, only enemies.
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  • IldamosIldamos Posts: 70
    Arkham wrote:
    Dexterity in TL1 is solely a ranged physical damage attribute (i.e. for guns, bows, etc.). Has no effect on magic spells.

    Your own AOE spells should not affect pets/minions, only enemies.

    Thanks for the informative reply. Dang. I wasted about 10 or so points in Dexterity >.<
  • SkladzienSkladzien Posts: 419
    Ildamos wrote:
    Arkham wrote:
    Dexterity in TL1 is solely a ranged physical damage attribute (i.e. for guns, bows, etc.). Has no effect on magic spells.

    Your own AOE spells should not affect pets/minions, only enemies.

    Thanks for the informative reply. Dang. I wasted about 10 or so points in Dexterity >.<

    Install Easy respecs for TL1 :) And you can set your dex to 0 :)
    Mods are the essence of Torchlight, there is no Torchlight without mods :)
    steamaw.php?id=skladzien&pngimg=shiny_rounded_long&achieve=TorchlightII&tborder=2
  • IldamosIldamos Posts: 70
    Skladzien wrote:
    Ildamos wrote:
    Arkham wrote:
    Dexterity in TL1 is solely a ranged physical damage attribute (i.e. for guns, bows, etc.). Has no effect on magic spells.

    Your own AOE spells should not affect pets/minions, only enemies.

    Thanks for the informative reply. Dang. I wasted about 10 or so points in Dexterity >.<

    Install Easy respecs for TL1 :) And you can set your dex to 0 :)
    Mods are the essence of Torchlight, there is no Torchlight without mods :)

    Dude thanks! Will use the Respec Mod though since i've heard it was made by one of the devs!
  • zekromzekrom Posts: 114
    Arkham wrote:
    Dexterity in TL1 is solely a ranged physical damage attribute (i.e. for guns, bows, etc.). Has no effect on magic spells.

    guns,bows....wands too!!! it affects ANY ranged weapon.

    it has no effect on magic spells....spells or skills? if spells all attributes have no effect on them. if skills look at the tooltip. any attribute will increase the skill damage if it says so on the tooltip.
  • ArkhamArkham Posts: 3,295 ✭✭✭
    zekrom wrote:
    guns,bows....wands too!!! it affects ANY ranged weapon.
    Wands have elemental damage, which is not affected by dexterity. Dexterity only acts on weapons with ranged physical damage.
    zekrom wrote:
    it has no effect on magic spells....spells or skills? if spells all attributes have no effect on them. if skills look at the tooltip. any attribute will increase the skill damage if it says so on the tooltip.
    Yes, but this thread is in the Alchemist section. I don't know of any Alchemist skills that use Dexterity. The Vanquisher might have some.
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  • dreamriderdreamrider Posts: 1,727
    Arkham wrote:
    zekrom wrote:
    guns,bows....wands too!!! it affects ANY ranged weapon.
    Wands have elemental damage, which is not affected by dexterity. Dexterity only acts on weapons with ranged physical damage.
    zekrom wrote:
    it has no effect on magic spells....spells or skills? if spells all attributes have no effect on them. if skills look at the tooltip. any attribute will increase the skill damage if it says so on the tooltip.
    Yes, but this thread is in the Alchemist section. I don't know of any Alchemist skills that use Dexterity. The Vanquisher might have some.

    zek, I thought the same thing that you did, that Dex growth would affect Wands, because they are ranged as well as elemental. Also, There is language in the manual and the character sheet tips that can be read to support this idea. However, after reading Arkham's reply I did some empirical testing. Its true - improving Dex does not improve the displayed damage numbers for a Wand (at least not for a purely elemental wand - it might be interesting to see what happens to a wand with a couple of embedded Pure Ember shards.) It is masked a little because the damage scope numbers appear in BOTH the ranged damage line and in the elemental damage line, but the two lines are identical, and the damage shown only changes if the Mag Attribute is improved.

    When I have the right situation, I want to test some staves, and also to see what happens to something like a Fire Dragonne in the hands of a Dex character vs a Mag character.

    dreamrider
  • dreamriderdreamrider Posts: 1,727
    OK, situation seems to be the same with staves and Str/melee damage. If the staff only does elemental damage, the per hit damage amount will show up in both the melee damage line and in the elemental damage line. However, the two damage ranges will be identical, and that damage amount will only change when the Magic Attribute changes.

    Now, an Ice Dragonne is interesting. Basically it shows up like a wand (it has only elemental damage.) Same damage scope in 'Ranged' and 'Elemental' damage. I don't know yet what happens when the Dex or Mag change.

    dreamrider
  • dreamriderdreamrider Posts: 1,727
    Hmm...a character equipped with the Ice Dragonne rifle (pure elemental damage) DOES increase in damage per hit when ONLY the Dexterity attribute is increased.

    This leads me back towrd the notion that I held long ago, then moved away from, that Attribute increases effect on damage results are tied to the class of weapon, rather than to the type of damage.

    I don't have an appropriate character right now to test what happens when a character equipped with a pure elemental rifle increases only the Magic Attribute.

    Unless someone out there has already done the experimenting??

    dreamrider
  • zekromzekrom Posts: 114
    dreamrider wrote:
    zek, I thought the same thing that you did, that Dex growth would affect Wands, because they are ranged as well as elemental. Also, There is language in the manual and the character sheet tips that can be read to support this idea. However, after reading Arkham's reply I did some empirical testing. Its true - improving Dex does not improve the displayed damage numbers for a Wand (at least not for a purely elemental wand - it might be interesting to see what happens to a wand with a couple of embedded Pure Ember shards.) It is masked a little because the damage scope numbers appear in BOTH the ranged damage line and in the elemental damage line, but the two lines are identical, and the damage shown only changes if the Mag Attribute is improved.

    When I have the right situation, I want to test some staves, and also to see what happens to something like a Fire Dragonne in the hands of a Dex character vs a Mag character.

    dreamrider

    hey dream i tested it again with a wand that has only fire damage. gave the character 100 dexterity and both the numbers beside dex AND mag changed. can u check again by increasing dex by a huge amount?

    and yeah..to get physical on wands is pure ember the only way? enchanting it wont do? im asking u coz u said u enchant a lot.
  • dreamriderdreamrider Posts: 1,727
    I had a long step by step thing that I was working out while I worked on the reply, and the page timed out. Pooh.

    Summarizing results.

    Yes, I have wands that I have enchanted to include a great deal of physical damage. Leonardo's Conundrum is the only wand I can find that has native physical damage.

    I experimented with a stripped down Vanq with (white) Dex 406, Mag 7, and 9 levels of RWE (+36% ranged damage). I used a Frost Scepter with 13-26 ice damage (only), with a Practice Bow of 11-22 physical ranged damage as a control.

    I calculated what the damage should be under the cases of 1) only MAG is used for wand ranged elemental bonus, 2) DEX and MAG count toward ranged elemental bonus, 3) DEX, MAG, and RWE count toward ranged elemental bonus. Then I handed the weapon to the character in the game and compared the displayed results to my calcs.

    It appears that the game uses DEX and MAG, but not RWE to calc the total ranged damage done by a wand. In all cases I looked at with wands, just the elemental damage, alebit ranged, is shown in the elemental line. All ranged damage is shown in the ranged line. This works out to the 2 lines being the same for the typical wand with no physical damage, but not when you have enchanted on a PD component. (I did not have a Leonardo's to test a pure physical wand.)

    All of this begs the question: When you shoot and hit with a wand, does the game apply a) the damage from the "ranged damage" line only (probable), b) the damage from the "elemental damage" damage line only (unlikely), or c) an additive damage result from BOTH the ranged damage line AND the elemental damage line (highly unlikely, but great! if true.)

    dreamrider
  • zekromzekrom Posts: 114
    yeah i was 100% sure about dex affecting all components of ANY ranged weapon. so i was shocked outta my wits when arkham said it dosent affect wands. well, anyway, u confirmed my results...

    BUT why the **** did u go through all that ****??
    what i did
    >make a test char-->give it 1000 all attributes-->equip a wand and look at damage-->then give the character 1000 dex (only dex) again and look at damage-->if it changes dex affects wands-->keep the test char for further tests instead of deleting it.

    and yeah i knew about rwe not affecting wands coz the skill has a tooltip which says only pistols,rifles,bows.
    dreamrider wrote:
    All of this begs the question: When you shoot and hit with a wand, does the game apply a) the damage from the "ranged damage" line only (probable), b) the damage from the "elemental damage" damage line only (unlikely), or c) an additive damage result from BOTH the ranged damage line AND the elemental damage line (highly unlikely, but great! if true.)

    dreamrider

    no no no. none of them. it calculates all the components(phy,f,i,e,p) seperately and then reduces each resist then adds all the final parts together.
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