Melee Destroyer Guide

harihari Posts: 50
edited September 2012 in Destroyer Discussions
There is plenty of information on how to build your dual wielding Destroyer on this forum but it is scattered all over the place. So I've decided to make my own guide. Here it goes...
ALL THE SKILL TESTING WAS REDONE ON THE 1.12 VERSION OF THE GAME!!!
Take a look at my Ranged Destroyer Guide too.


Philosophy

Our Destroyer will be a dual wielding swords/maces/axes (anything that falls in the Martial Weapons Expertise). He will be doing massive damage and receiving as little as possible. And we want him to use his skills all the time. That's right, no normal attacks. So here is how you do it.


Stats

None in Dexterity.
You've guest it ... none in Magic. I've noticed that some people are spending points in Magic. Investing some points in Magic does actually increase your normal attack more then pure Strength build (if you have enough elemental damage), but that is not the case with skills. I've done some testing and you can see the results 2 posts down.
Everything goes into Strength and Defense. The ratio is up to you. You can try one half in Strength and the other one in Defense. It all really depends on your equipment. If you have good armor on, you can get away with less Defense. But if you are dying to much, you should definitely pump it up. Defense also increase your Elemental Resistance by a certain percent (1 point in Defense = 1% of base Elemental Resistance).


Skills

Points distribution:

10 points in: Dual Wielding, Martial Weapons Expertise, Critical Strikes, Devastate, Armor Expertise, Frost Shield, Spectral Decay, Block and Perry, Defensive Spell Mastery, Adventurer.
4+ points in Shadow Armor.
1 point in Slash Attack (by default).
As much as needed in Advance Spellcasting.
If you have any points left you can put them in Offensive Spell Mastery, Treasure Hunter, Barter.

Passive skills:
Dual Wielding, Martial Weapons Expertise, Critical Strikes, Armor Expertise, Block and Perry, Defensive Spell Mastery, Adventurer, Advance Spellcasting.


You will want to max the first three skills (Dual Wielding, Martial Weapons Expertise and Critical Strikes) for raising your damage.
Armor Expertise will help you survive longer so we will max it as well.
Defensive Spell Mastery upgrades defensive spells (Haste, Heal All, Heal Self, Elemental Protection,...) You should have this skill maxed by level 25. Devastate just isn't all that useful without good Haste.
Advance Spellcasting helps you regenerate mana faster. If you are desperately running out of mana, this is the skill for you.
Adventurer is a very useful skill once you have 3000+ health and are running out of health potions, as it increases the effectiveness of potions. It also gives a nice bonus to Experience and Fame Gain.
Block and Perry increases your chance to Block even if you are not carrying a shield. Keep in mind that every kind of attack can be blocked.

Attacking skills:
Slash Attack, Devastate.


Slash Attack is the mother of mana to damage ratio. It also has an Interrupt Chance which means that the target's attack or cast can be interrupted if it gets hit by Slash Attack. You will want to keep this skill at level 1. Upgrading this skill will only give you worse mana to damage ratio, so don't upgrade it. Slash Attack will provide you a good attack early in the game.
Devastate does justice to its name. It gives you a good % of Weapons DPS, slows targets down, reduces the targets defense, increases your moving speed and adds a little damage over a period of 6 seconds. You will want to max this skill. High mana cost at level 1 and only 1 additional mana per level, makes this skill one of a few attacking skills that is actually worth upgrading in this game. Forgot to mention that this will be your only attack once you get to level 25.
These two skills are the only ones using all equipped weapons. That means that DPS is added from both weapons. Stampede for example uses only one weapons DPS when cast, even if you have two equipped weapons.

Recastable skills (don't know if that is the right way to describe them):
Shadow Armor, Entropic Aura, Spectral Decay, Frost Shield.

Entropic Aura is a good way to slow your enemies down and it gives an Interruption Chance. There is a huge problem however. Casting Devastate breaks currently active aura. You can use Entropic Aura with your Slash Attack but once you get Devastate it will became a waste of points. That is way I am recommending 0 points in this skill.
Frost Shield will be your best defense. At level 10 it gives you 90% Chance to Cast Frost Shock when you get hit, that means that almost every monster that lands a hit on you will be slowed down. You get a 75% Knock Back Resistance and we are not getting to the fun part yet. At level 10 this skill will give you an almighty Physical and Elemental Damage Take in Reduced by 54%. That's right 54%! The only downside is that you will have to recast it every 20 seconds, but it is worth the effort and the mana it uses.
Spectral Decay is another great skill. At level 10 it will increase the damage monsters take by 100% and it also gives a nice 70% Chance to Stunt for 3 seconds. This will definitely give you a helping hand against bosses and mobs. It also has some Knock Back that helps to keep mobs away while you cast it.
And now for the screwed up skill Shadow Armor. It summons a phantasm that does practically no damage and it gives a % Increased Chance to Block. And now for the screwed up part of the skill ... the phantasm stays with you for the whole duration of the skill (29 seconds at level 1) but the % Block goes away after, from what I could tell, 13 seconds. What is more, the Block goes back to 0 after 13 seconds of each cast. So if you cast it at 0 seconds and then again at 12 seconds, you will see the Block bonus, that skill gives you, go back to 0 at 13 seconds. My advise is to cast this skill along with Frost Shield (it has a cooldown time of 20 seconds). When you upgrade Shadow Armor, the length of the % Block bonus increases by 2 seconds per level. So this is what you do: with level 4 Shadow Armor and level 10 Block and Perry, you will have 33% Block that lasts 19 seconds, then your Frost Shield wears off and that's when you recast Frost Shield along with Shadow Armor. This tactic doesn't give you max block of 50% but you will always know where you stand with your Shadow Armor. Once you have high level Haste spell (that last more then 20 seconds) you can cast you Shadow Armor along with Haste. That way you can upgrade you Shadow Armor even more and still know when it wears off (remember, it starts with 13 seconds duration at level 1 and it gains extra 2 seconds for every level).


Equipment

Weapons:
Look for the highest DPS weapons as that is the main source of your damage. The weapon should have adds like Critical Hit Chance, % Bonus to Critical Damage and Increase All Physical Damage by %. Weapon speed is almost irrelevant. Devastate isn't effected by it but enchantments are. If you are planning to enchant your weapon (you definitely should) it sometimes pay off to enchant a faster weapon (even if it has slightly lower DPS) as it will benefit more from +damage enchantments compared to slower weapons.

Armor:
Look for the highest value armor you can find. Your armor must have 100+% Chance to Reflect Missile Damage (you can get it from 3 or more different pieces of armor as the Chance to Reflect Missiles stacks). 100+% Chance to Reflect Missile will make you immune to arrows and even some spells like Fireball and Poison Bolt as they will just bounce off you. You get the Health/Mana Stolen on Hit bonus if reflected arrows hit a monster and archers can actually kill themselves by attacking you. One more thing you will need on your armor is Elemental Resistance. Critical Damage can also be found on armors but I would give advantage to the armor value and resistance unless the monsters can't touch you. If you are using my tactic with level 4 Shadow Armor a little % Block on you armor wouldn't hurt.

Rings and Amulet:
Rings with Health and Mana are all good. They should also have Elemental Resistance, Attribute Bonus,... Basically just find a nice ring or amulet and enchant the **** out of it.

This goes for all equipment: You don't need Faster Attack Speed and Life Leech as it only applies to normal attacks. We won't be using those. Faster Cast Speed is the way to go, as all of your casting skills are affected buy it.


Spells

I normally use Identify spell. That way I never run out of Identify Scrolls (because I don't use them) and don't have to spend money buying them.
Haste is a must have spell. The Destroyer is just crazy fast using Devastate with Haste activated. Or you can just use it for running around really really fast.
If you are having troubles with Dragonkins, you could use an Elemental Resistance spell. With level 10 Defensive Spell Mastery and high Defense stats it can make a difference.
Heal Self is also useful if you are running out of health potions, and it has a lot lower cooldown time compered to Heal All.
Dervish is another must have spell along with Haste. It increases your cast rate.
As for the pet's spells, you will probably benefit the most from Heal All spells. Remember, your pet can have two Heal All spells if they are of different levels. You can also put one Frost spell on your pet. It doesn't do much damage but it slows targets considerably.


Tips and Tricks

Use Devastate by clicking your mouse button and NOT by holding it. By clicking it you get two things: you deal damage faster and you are using less mana.
If you are having problems with Blood Disciples, it is good to know that they only cast Stampede once in a while. If you manage to avoid the first Stampede (move sideways) they become easy pickings.


That's all folks!

I am open to suggestions but please back them up with some **** numbers, screenshots or plain old logic.
And if you have any questions just fire away.


Special Thanks to

Tharn
«1

Comments

  • Nice guide. I want to put my two cents:

    1) Shadow armor has been fixed in the 1.12 patch. Don't stack anymore.

    2) For **** chars: raise skeletons is very usefull, they are good meatwalls and do decent damage. If you want to use them, considere to spend some skill points in pet mastery and charm spell mastery.

    3) The pet is not very clever using Heall All, you should use it too.

    And a question: is it a good idea to spend some points in Magic? Maybe 2str/1mg/2def?
  • harihari Posts: 50
    edited November 2009
    Firstly I guess I will have to get the new patch and do a retest on all skills :D Tnx for the heads up!

    The pet is as clever as he can be with the Heal All spell. If he has the mana and the spell is ready to use (Heal All has a very long cooldown) he casts it.

    As for Heal All spell for you Destroyer, I think that Heal Self is much more useful as it has a shorter cooldown.

    About your question (is it a good idea to spend some points in Magic? Maybe 2str/1mg/2def?)
    I've done some testing and here are my findings...
    Level 34 Destroyer using level 10 Devastate on a level 39 unique Troll monster. I've killed the same Troll over and over to get some useful results. My Destroyer also had level 10 Duel Wielding, Martial Weapons Expertise and Critical Strikes.
    I've distributed stat points twice. First time all in strength (148 Strength and 22 Magic) and the second time almost 2:1 (110 Strength and 60 Magic). Here are the numbers...
    All Strength: min normal dmg 3124, max normal dmg 5012, min critical dmg 7519, max critical dmg 12674.
    Str 2: Mg 1: min normal dmg 3035, max normal dmg 4796, min critical dmg 6774, max critical dmg 12168.
    It would be practically impossible to get those number if the 2 Strength : 1 Magic distribution of stat points would be better.
    Bottom line, 2 Strength : 1 Magic definitely isn't better for a Destroyer with my equipment!

    And here is my equipment:

    Weapon 1 (474 DPS):
    70-139 physical dmg
    26-52 electric dmg
    26-52 fire dmg
    26-52 ice dmg
    26-52 poison dmg

    Weapon 2 (511 DPS):
    73-146 physical dmg
    24-48 dire dmg
    24-48 poison dmg

    Adds on other pieces of equipment:
    +48 poison dmg
    +64 fire dmg
    +71 electric dmg
    elemental dmg increased by 52%
    poison dmg increased by 40%
    ice dmg increased by 27%
    fire dmg increased by 25%
    physical and elemental dmg increased by 23%

    As you can see I have about the same elemental and physical dmg and I still get at least as much dmg by investing all points into Strength as I would with 2 Strength : 1 Magic.
    If anyone else has some testing results that contradict my findings pleas let me know (but don't forget to list the dmg, equipment, stats,...).
  • BlazeBlaze Posts: 5
    Nice guide!

    Only one thing:
    I'm pretty sure that entropic aura lasts longer than its cooldown, so it can be constatly activated.
  • harihari Posts: 50
    Like I said in the previous post. I will get the 1.12 patch of the game and retest all skills.
  • TharnTharn Posts: 25
    Devastate always breaks immediately every active aura, so if you're using Devastate as main attack, all points spent in auras are useless. I do not know if this is a bug or a designed feature, I'd go for the first as there are no real reasons why auras would work with every other attack skill but Devastate.

    As for spells, I'd recommend getting Dervish VI. It has only 20 second duration with Dervish VI and max Offensive Spells Mastery while having a massive 60 second cooldown, but it's still a very powerful and usefull skill. You get +60% attack and cast speed with level 10 Offensive Spells Mastery, so I think you get the idea why it's so effective.

    Elemental Protection ain't necessary all that important, and although the resistance bonuses it offers seem to be a bit low, you need to notify that your Defense attribute increases them higher. I got around +300 resist all from level 10 Defensive Spell Mastery Elemental Protection VI with my Destroyer, I think that much extra resistance is well worth the occasional recast.

    You also didn't note anything about the Spell Masteries. Although Destroyers are supposed to be brainless melee tank by their class, it doesn't mean that they wouldn't benefit from spellcasting as well as any other class. Haste is a truly useful skill for any Destroyer, so it's well forth the investment to develop Defensive Spells Mastery, and you get ever so more reason to start using Elemental Protection too, as it gains benefits from Defensive Spell Mastery as well.

    Only truly useful Offensive Spell for a Destroyer is Dervish, but as maxing out Offensive Spells Mastery doubles the attack & cast speed you benefit I think that's well worth the skill point investments.

    As with Pet spells go, Frost VI is really nice on it. Damage it does is a joke, but the freezing effect it provides is very useful. Area of Effect is also very large, sometimes your pet can freeze almost a complete mob with the spell. That equals free kills for you, although you need to do all the damage yourself.

    Destroyer also becomes completely mana independent once you develop your Advanced Spellcasting to level 5 or so. Although the reduction of level requirements for scrolls are useless with this skill, the extra mana regen it provides makes you completely independent from mana potions as your mana regen is faster than you can use on your skills. A really important skill to a Destroyer of any character level.

    One of the last truly beneficial skills for any high level character is the Adventurer skill. Although you wouldn't need the experience and fame bonuses it grants, it's the potion efficiency what comes really important once your character has over 3000 to 4000 max health. Grand Healing Potions are the best healing potions you can find in the game, but as they only heal you for 2000 hitpoints, it gets like drinking water and you'll be constantly popping new health potions just to get your health level filled. The true benefits from the +80% potion efficiency the skill grants at level 10 is much higher than you would suspect. Although it would seem obvious that +80% potion efficiency would heal you for 3600 total health with Grand Healing Potions using 2000 heal as base, I've found that the effect is much higher. At level 100, my Destroyer had over 8000 maximum health, but still any Grand Healing Potion drank healed me fully and in a very rabid speed. You really need fast heal in lower levels of Shadow Vault. This skills is useful for any character level though. Any point you find out that you're using more health potions or mana than you can find from the dungeon, investment in Adventurer (or Advanced Spellcasting in case of mana shortage) can pay off fast.
  • harihari Posts: 50
    In the 1.1 version, Devastate doesn't break the active aura. Only when you release button (stop casting Devastate) aura ceases to work. :D

    All the skills you have listed (Defensive Spell Mastery, Adventurer, Advanced Spellcasting,...) are mentioned at the end of the Skills guide. But you are right that Advanced Spellcasting probably deserves a place higher up in the guide.

    If what you say about Elemental Resistance spell is true, then it really migth be useful. I just assumed that it doesn't receive any bonus from Defense stats.

    Thanks for you info!
  • TharnTharn Posts: 25
    hari wrote:
    In the 1.1 version, Devastate doesn't break the active aura. Only when you release button (stop casting Devastate) aura ceases to work. :D

    All the skills you have listed (Defensive Spell Mastery, Adventurer, Advanced Spellcasting,...) are mentioned at the end of the Skills guide. But you are right that Advanced Spellcasting probably deserves a place higher up in the guide.

    Thanks for you info!

    I use Devastate differently as I don't keep it pressed down, but just click it with the pattern of attacks. From my observations, you don't gain any benefits from keeping the attack button pressed down for Devastate. You can just click it, and still you attack as fast as keeping the mouse button down and even faster when combined with Dervish. I found out that Devastate ain't all that fast while Dervish is used if you just keep the attack button down. But if you just click it, you attack pretty much as fast as you can just press the mouse button. So, using that way with the skill, you can't use auras combined with it. I didn't even know that it's the release of Dervish what breaks the aura and not the skill itself. Anyway, this might a bug or undesigned feature in the skill, as it has mana consumption as per second, but nevertheless its working fine, haven't tried it with 1.12 version yet though, as I already retired my Destroyer.

    And yup, seems that you do notify the spell masteries in your guide, you just mention them so shortly that I didn't even notice. I think you should add more describing text for them; some peepz might not even realize how much you can benefit from Spell Masteries, so I think it's worth to explain them a bit further.
  • harihari Posts: 50
    WOW! Using Devastate by clicking the mouse is unbelievable. It definitely calls for a Tips and Tricks section in this guide. It deals damage faster and uses less mana. Don't know how could I have missed that!

    About your other suggestions ... the guide is being fixed as I type.

    Tnx again!
  • The Identify spell is handy as you'll burn scrolls faster than you find them, but will not really free up an inventory slot as you'd expect (see below.)

    Teleport spell is a waste of a spell slot, IMO. If you're frantically clicking, you'll have looted at least one (likely many) by the time you go to cast it. Also, as they stack, they're usually the last items I offload to the pet to sell. Between Elemental Resist, Self Heal, Haste, Dervish, Skeletons, you've got plenty of options to fill your remaining three slots, should you learn Identify.

    edit: I'd suspect Devastate is bugged/not working as intended in regards to the "click" method. It uses almost zero mana, and certainly not 25 mana minimum per click that I expected.

    Final comment regarding mana: what is so bad about mana potions? So long as you're not burning them faster than you're picking them up, it seems that points in mana regen are wasted. Is there really a reason to get to the point where you NEVER need mana pots?
    CURRENTly dead. /// DEAD 14, 20, 22(VH), 33 Destroyers (H HC) /// **** or bust.
    Gameplay Changing Mods: DestroyerSkillsDuration
  • kronchevkronchev Posts: 129
    Why would you use skeletons on yourself? Put it on the pet!
    My build
    http://tinyurl.com/y8b6suw

    My tips
    You can block without a shield, 2h weapons have the same DPS as 1h weapons, Shadow Armor is your best friend, learn your 1 point wonders: Frost Shield, Entropic Aura, Stampede, Spectral Decay
  • kronchev wrote:
    Why would you use skeletons on yourself? Put it on the pet!

    Three second cooldown with a longer duration at higher ranks lets you pop out a decent sized army should you need it.
    CURRENTly dead. /// DEAD 14, 20, 22(VH), 33 Destroyers (H HC) /// **** or bust.
    Gameplay Changing Mods: DestroyerSkillsDuration
  • harihari Posts: 50
    I never said that having Town Portal scroll is useful. I just stated that I normally have it. Haste, Dervish, Heal Self and Elemental Resistance or even some Summon spells will definitely benefit your Destroyer more then Identify or Town Portal spells. If it bothers you that much I will take out the Town Portal spell from the guide.

    You probably suspect correctly that the use of the clicking method on the Devastation skill wasn't intended to burn so little mana or even to deal damage faster then by holding the mouse button. But there is nothing I can do about it.
  • TharnTharn Posts: 25
    ambrose wrote:
    Final comment regarding mana: what is so bad about mana potions? So long as you're not burning them faster than you're picking them up, it seems that points in mana regen are wasted. Is there really a reason to get to the point where you NEVER need mana pots?

    At later point of the game you have so many skills and spells to micromanage during the regular gameplay, that you really need all those 10 utility belt slots. When you can disregard mana potions completely, you free an extra slot in your belt and you don't need to keep watching your mana level. Also, you constantly need to keep recasting your Haste, Dervish, Frost Shield, Shadow Armor, Spectral Decay, Elemental protection... so many skills and most of them have only a bit over 20 seconds of duration. You really don't want to take care about your mana level with that much of constant spell and skill using.

    Besides, even with that many different skills to develop, I found out I ran out of reasonable skills to develop after around exp level 90. I already maxed out every single skill I used on my playing style, that there wasn't even any other related skills left to develop. Last eight level ups, I developed as useless skill as Pet Mastery because i lacked any other useful options. Figured that it would keep my pet alive longer for more Frost casts, but found it out pretty much useless. Anyway, it was the last skill with any benefits to my character, and even that provided much more useless than being independent from mana potions. Although you find them in abundance, its still the extra trouble keeping your mana levels high and watching out for your potion amount. And although you pick them up constantly even accidentally, they give really good amounts of gold upon selling. So they are an excellent source of gold as well.
  • kronchevkronchev Posts: 129
    ambrose wrote:
    kronchev wrote:
    Why would you use skeletons on yourself? Put it on the pet!

    Three second cooldown with a longer duration at higher ranks lets you pop out a decent sized army should you need it.

    You make an interesting point, I might give that a shot. EP VI has broken my heart with its badness.
    My build
    http://tinyurl.com/y8b6suw

    My tips
    You can block without a shield, 2h weapons have the same DPS as 1h weapons, Shadow Armor is your best friend, learn your 1 point wonders: Frost Shield, Entropic Aura, Stampede, Spectral Decay
  • cyraxcyrax Posts: 5
    I appreciate the guide and the useful posts therein. Thanks all!
  • kronchev wrote:
    You make an interesting point, I might give that a shot. EP VI has broken my heart with its badness.

    Even with the +defensive magic skills? Rank IV (I think it was) I was using on my 33 gave a decent bump and I had no skill points improving it. It made a noticeable difference and I kept it up 100%. Maybe it just doesn't scale endgame?

    As seen from my sig, I'm not too experienced, but this run I'm switching to VH and going Heal Self, Elemental Protection, Skeleton, and probably Haste. (I might do Identify until I can make Haste awesome/worth casting, I'm not sure how the lower ranks are at base.) Goofing off with a lowbie summoner alch really opened my eyes to how powerful the the 3 second skeletons really are.
    CURRENTly dead. /// DEAD 14, 20, 22(VH), 33 Destroyers (H HC) /// **** or bust.
    Gameplay Changing Mods: DestroyerSkillsDuration
  • jamesLjamesL Posts: 3,568
    you should add a section for off builds, like dual wielding with a pistol and melee weapon
    1/2 dex and 1/2 str
    ranged weapon expertise, martial weapon expertise
    I know its no the best build, but its one I want to try out
    I don't have a sig
  • kronchevkronchev Posts: 129
    ambrose wrote:
    kronchev wrote:
    You make an interesting point, I might give that a shot. EP VI has broken my heart with its badness.

    Even with the +defensive magic skills? Rank IV (I think it was) I was using on my 33 gave a decent bump and I had no skill points improving it. It made a noticeable difference and I kept it up 100%. Maybe it just doesn't scale endgame?

    As seen from my sig, I'm not too experienced, but this run I'm switching to VH and going Heal Self, Elemental Protection, Skeleton, and probably Haste. (I might do Identify until I can make Haste awesome/worth casting, I'm not sure how the lower ranks are at base.) Goofing off with a lowbie summoner alch really opened my eyes to how powerful the the 3 second skeletons really are.

    At level 100 with 10/10 Defensive Spell Mastery it gives +47 resistance. That's a whole 47 extra points subtracted from spell effects which is horrible and quickly is outscaled by monsters.

    I'd rather summon a small army to provide a distraction
    My build
    http://tinyurl.com/y8b6suw

    My tips
    You can block without a shield, 2h weapons have the same DPS as 1h weapons, Shadow Armor is your best friend, learn your 1 point wonders: Frost Shield, Entropic Aura, Stampede, Spectral Decay
  • TharnTharn Posts: 25
    kronchev wrote:
    ambrose wrote:
    kronchev wrote:
    You make an interesting point, I might give that a shot. EP VI has broken my heart with its badness.

    Even with the +defensive magic skills? Rank IV (I think it was) I was using on my 33 gave a decent bump and I had no skill points improving it. It made a noticeable difference and I kept it up 100%. Maybe it just doesn't scale endgame?

    As seen from my sig, I'm not too experienced, but this run I'm switching to VH and going Heal Self, Elemental Protection, Skeleton, and probably Haste. (I might do Identify until I can make Haste awesome/worth casting, I'm not sure how the lower ranks are at base.) Goofing off with a lowbie summoner alch really opened my eyes to how powerful the the 3 second skeletons really are.

    At level 100 with 10/10 Defensive Spell Mastery it gives +47 resistance. That's a whole 47 extra points subtracted from spell effects which is horrible and quickly is outscaled by monsters.

    I'd rather summon a small army to provide a distraction

    That's what the spell description says, but the actual effect is much more effective as Elemental Protection gets increased by your Defense attribute, just check your resistances in your character sheets before and after casting. With almost 400 in Defense with my lvl 100 Destroyer, I got around +300 resist all from Elemental Protection. Although I had most resistances at over 1200 or so, I still wouldn't call the effect useless, as resistance is one of the most hardest attributes to achieve in the game and some of the elemental attacks of monsters in the game are just wicked. But up until level 200 defense or so, it might not be such a great spell to constantly recast, if you can handle the incoming elemental damage.

    Later in the game, casting summons gets pretty much useless. Their only benefit would be their tanking effect, but as monsters can kill your summons with single hits, they don't make up much of an meatshield. I don't know how much their endurance increases with Charm Spell Mastery, but I seriously doubt their effectiveness even with level 10 Charm Spell Mastery. Considering the constant recast requirements, I think it would get really tedious way to play as soon as monsters start to tear your summons to pieces. Personally, I think it's just much easier and effective just to attack those monsters directly yourself, and resolving in other defensive tactics.
  • kronchevkronchev Posts: 129
    Tharn wrote:
    That's what the spell description says, but the actual effect is much more effective as Elemental Protection gets increased by your Defense attribute, just check your resistances in your character sheets before and after casting. With almost 400 in Defense with my lvl 100 Destroyer, I got around +300 resist all from Elemental Protection. Although I had most resistances at over 1200 or so, I still wouldn't call the effect useless, as resistance is one of the most hardest attributes to achieve in the game and some of the elemental attacks of monsters in the game are just wicked. But up until level 200 defense or so, it might not be such a great spell to constantly recast, if you can handle the incoming elemental damage.

    Later in the game, casting summons gets pretty much useless. Their only benefit would be their tanking effect, but as monsters can kill your summons with single hits, they don't make up much of an meatshield. I don't know how much their endurance increases with Charm Spell Mastery, but I seriously doubt their effectiveness even with level 10 Charm Spell Mastery. Considering the constant recast requirements, I think it would get really tedious way to play as soon as monsters start to tear your summons to pieces. Personally, I think it's just much easier and effective just to attack those monsters directly yourself, and resolving in other defensive tactics.

    Oh wow, you're right, I get over 200 +res, which is a lot better. Thanks for pointing that out!

    I wish they got their **** together and created correct tooltips...
    My build
    http://tinyurl.com/y8b6suw

    My tips
    You can block without a shield, 2h weapons have the same DPS as 1h weapons, Shadow Armor is your best friend, learn your 1 point wonders: Frost Shield, Entropic Aura, Stampede, Spectral Decay
  • RMJRMJ Posts: 40
    Nice guide, but again what difficulty you people play on ? easy, normal and hard well anything works there ^^, Very hard however, its nice to know if the guide and people who has what in what of stats are playing on Very hard :)
  • harihari Posts: 50
    kronchev wrote:

    Oh wow, you're right, I get over 200 +res, which is a lot better. Thanks for pointing that out!

    I wish they got their **** together and created correct tooltips...

    The bonus on Elemental Resistance from Defense is mentioned in the guide, TWICE! All you have to do is read it.
    RMJ wrote:

    Nice guide, but again what difficulty you people play on ? easy, normal and hard well anything works there ^^, Very hard however, its nice to know if the guide and people who has what in what of stats are playing on Very hard :)

    This guide will work on all difficulties. The only difference would be, that you can spend less points in Defense if you are playing on Easy or Normal as the monsters are weaker then on Very Hard (go figure). The stats distribution is a tricky thing. It all depends on your equipment. My advice to you is this: if you are using tones of health potions just to stay alive, you need to invest more in your Defense. Otherwise spend your stat points in Strength for higher damage and therefor faster killing.
    If this is still to general for you, try this. Put half in Defense and half in Strength until level 30 or so (on Very Hard). By then you should already figure out if you need more points in Defense or not. And you should also know, that right stats distribution isn't enough on Very Hard difficulty. You need to enchant your equipment too.
  • kronchevkronchev Posts: 129
    hari wrote:
    The bonus on Elemental Resistance from Defense is mentioned in the guide, TWICE! All you have to do is read it.

    Honestly I don't have a single problem with my DW Destroyer so no reason to really read it; well, maybe this one fact would've been reason, but that's only because I'm pretty useless about how Spells work.
    My build
    http://tinyurl.com/y8b6suw

    My tips
    You can block without a shield, 2h weapons have the same DPS as 1h weapons, Shadow Armor is your best friend, learn your 1 point wonders: Frost Shield, Entropic Aura, Stampede, Spectral Decay
  • jackxjackx Posts: 139
    With regard to offense/defense stat distribution and potion use: Movement is key. A DW-destroyers damage output might increase with the number of enemies he's fighting at the same time, but that shouldn't keep you from keeping that number as low as possible unless you're sleepwalking on easy or normal... slash is great for hit-and-run, so even if you don't 1-hit, you shouldn't need potions outside of boss fights, stair/portal rushes and maneuvering yourself into a situation where you get swarmed. :) For the latter two, TS-spam works wonders btw...
    axtbenutzer.jpg
    no truth - no justice
    all false belief
    blinded by morality
    there shall be... no peace
    no peace!
  • jamesLjamesL Posts: 3,568
    And now for the screwed up skill Shadow Armor. It summons a phantasm that does 0 damage ...
    I must be misunderstanding you
    a cheated up a destroyer with level 10 Shadow Armor and level 10 Frost Shield and then I did nothing but cast and recast them
    I never swung a melee weapon once and enemies were falling all around me; I could see the floaty numbers with damage in the 100's every time my Shadow Armor hit something
    I don't have a sig
  • harihari Posts: 50
    edited November 2009
    jamesL wrote:
    And now for the screwed up skill Shadow Armor. It summons a phantasm that does 0 damage ...
    I must be misunderstanding you
    a cheated up a destroyer with level 10 Shadow Armor and level 10 Frost Shield and then I did nothing but cast and recast them
    I never swung a melee weapon once and enemies were falling all around me; I could see the floaty numbers with damage in the 100's every time my Shadow Armor hit something

    The "screwed up" part of the skill isn't the damage on phantasm but the reset of Block every X seconds after the skill was cast. If you cast level 1 Shadow Armor at 0 seconds and then again at 10 seconds, you can see that the bonus to % Block will disappear at 13 seconds (% Block will appear if you hold your cursor over the damage absorbed next to Defense attribute). If you recast it again at 21 seconds, % Block bonus will go back to 0 again at 23 seconds (second cast was done at 10 seconds + 13 seconds duration). So if you recast you Shadow Armor too soon, you can end up with 0% Block from this skill most of the time. That is why I am recommending casting Shadow Armor along with another skill that has the same duration as the Block bonus on Shadow Armor (the Block bonus duration isn't the same as the phantasm duration!!!).

    The damage on phantasm isn't really 0 but compared to the damage your Destroyer makes it might as well be.
  • jamesLjamesL Posts: 3,568
    hari wrote:
    jamesL wrote:
    And now for the screwed up skill Shadow Armor. It summons a phantasm that does 0 damage ...
    I must be misunderstanding you
    a cheated up a destroyer with level 10 Shadow Armor and level 10 Frost Shield and then I did nothing but cast and recast them
    I never swung a melee weapon once and enemies were falling all around me; I could see the floaty numbers with damage in the 100's every time my Shadow Armor hit something
    ...
    The damage on phantasm isn't really 0 but compared to the damage your Destroyer makes it might as well be.


    ah, I see
    I took the 0 literally
    I don't have a sig
  • harihari Posts: 50
    jackx wrote:
    ... TS-spam works wonders btw...

    Titan Stomp is a waste of points. Spectral Decay works almost as well and it gives you an almighty +100% damage. The only advantage to Titan Stomp is, that you can use it early in the game. If you are having troubles with mobs at low levels you can put 1 point in Titan Stomp but you should definitely stop there.
  • jackxjackx Posts: 139
    Agreed, once you max spectral decay, you don't really need TS anymore, but up to lvl 30, that one point in TS can be very helpful in emergencies.
    axtbenutzer.jpg
    no truth - no justice
    all false belief
    blinded by morality
    there shall be... no peace
    no peace!
  • eXaeXa Posts: 1
    I have TL version 1.11 and the block from shadow armor is there the entire duration...
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