Charge building for Canon Engineer (Blast Canon)

lonerangerloneranger Posts: 102
edited March 2014 in Engineer Discussions
Hi Guys, Its me again :)

Paused my Berser builds for a change, I was trying to make a potential good build with Outlander and Engineer. Right now playing an Elite Canon-Engineer, main offence is Blast Canon and main defense is Force Field.

At the beginning, I thought this is gonna a killer build, because Force Field would be only charge dump, means I should be able to keep it up at max power most of the time. And I get to shoot AWESOME BLAST CANON from a safe distance with extra spicy FF protection lol

Then after playing a while I realized .. OH C**P !! Blast Canon doesn't build charge (its not stated at the tool tip) .. or may be it does but so little, its nowhere enough to power up FF. So right now building charge is my highest concern.

01. I can use my regular canon to build charge > activate FF > then resume blasting BC. Problem is, regular canon has very short range, kinda beats my purpose of keeping a "safe distance". It also interrupt the rhythm.

02. Charge ****, I already have 6 points in it > 5.5% chance to get full charge. This is the only charge I am getting now. Its nice to get all the charge bars filled at once, but at this stage, its not enough. I need to kill like 15-20 mobs to proc it, and only if there is enough mobs around. In a single boss fight, its useless. Its a chance to get charge, so I can't have it when I really need it. I wonder if it procs more frequently at 15 with 10% chance. Anyway I can't wait that long, without FF, life will be trouble.

03. Dynamo Field : Tried it with 5 points it it with another build, it goes well with melee engineer, but then again, my melee engineer has no charge issue because he has supercharge. I wonder is DF is better with 10 or a5 points in it and if it would be suitable for a canon build.

So thats it, I wish supercharge would work with Canons, and Shield bash is not an option. And I really wish the Blast Canon would build atleast some charge. With some mana regen gem, BC is incredible even at lvl 1.

Please suggest me what would be the best way for my canoneer to build some charge so he can keep his FF up and BC booming ! Thanks in advance.

Comments

  • I have another question, does Blast Canon apply the canon's effects? Like %chance to stun, or health/mana stolen?
  • bump because I got frustrated the same way. There could be at least some statement in the tooltip that you can't get charge from blast canon
  • GungaDin wrote:
    bump because I got frustrated the same way. There could be at least some statement in the tooltip that you can't get charge from blast canon

    Maybe it builds very little charge .. I don't know. May be BC doesn't supposed to build good charge, because then Canon engineers would be unstoppable immortal range killing machine.

    From my experience so far, charge **** is "no good" with Blast Canon builds. Because its worthless against bosses or single tank opponent. And against trash mob, you can build charge with your regular canon, it doesn't take long.

    Actually I have stopped thinking about charge, I am using FF without them. Its still good, just think of it as an additional HP boost that you can reapply again and again. Canon Engineer is a ranged build, so you are not supposed to get into melee range and eat damage. Its still very less squishy than other glasscanon/range build, and BC is awesome, it can clear any mob surrounding you in a few blasts so you should be okey. Level 10 BC has 50% chance to blind for 4 second which is like super!

    Aegis **** compared to even non-charged FF .. otherwise it would be ideal for this type of build. Agis should be fixed.
  • I just think spamming blast canon non stop gets boring and being able to build charge to use other skills could spice things up a bit. It's not really about force field, which I think is quite overpowered most ways you use it
  • As far as I know, Blast Cannon does NOT build any charge at all....nor does it apply HP or MP steal.
    Also...as far as I know, Blast Cannon DOES apply all kinds of "convey"...chance to convey: stun, blind, FireStorm, poison, fire, physical etc.

    If you want to stay blasting from a safe distance, then Charge **** is a must.

    I went full Blast Cannon on an earlier Engineer...but dropped it when I saw that I needed fully charged Force Field to tackle the mobs (Veteran Difficulty)

    My build (which have been pretty successful so far) is a "Fire Cannoneer".

    Blast Cannon: 15
    Healing Bot: 15
    Force Field: 15
    Seismic Slam: 15 (15 points to max out the damage and stun chance)
    Heavy Lifting: 15
    Coup-De-Grace: 15
    Fire and Spark: 15
    Immobilization Copter: 15 (can do with 5 if the skill points are needed elsewhere) (15 points to max out the debuff and apply the interrupt, 5 points to boost the debuff and make it hit 5 instead of 3 targets)

    That's 100 points from levels and 20 points from Fame.
    If I'm not mistaken, Fame reaches up to 33 (50 if you're using the Synergies MOD).
    The remaining 13 (or 23 if the Copter only have 5 points) can be put anywhere.
    I put 1 point into: Charge ****, Aegis of Fate and Charge Reconstitution....just to have them.

    My tactic is to pop Force Field then jump into the fray and use Seismic Slam to stun everything around me, then I just use the normal attack to build charge.
    Coup-De-Grace helps picking off the trash mobs fast, then I use Blast Cannon on the tougher mobs.
    By the time I've taken out a group of enemies, my charge bar is full and Force Field is recharged....pop a fully charged Force Field and run to the next group.

    Key elements to the gear for my build is to stack alot of bonus fire damage, the Aegis set (2 rings and a necklace) gives 115% bonus to fire damage.
    For the cannon I suggest a 0.88 or 1.0 attack speed.....no higher than 1.10...espically if you are gonna use the standard attack for charge building.
  • lonerangerloneranger Posts: 102
    lso...as far as I know, Blast Cannon DOES apply all kinds of "convey"...chance to convey: stun, blind, FireStorm, poison, fire, physical etc.

    I can assure you that Blast Cannon can stun and convey weapon properties except MP or HP leech like all weapon DPS based skill.

    I don't think the Cannoneer is an elite hc viable build, I tried it from many different approach.

    01. You can try to build charge using autoattack to power up your forcefield but that way you get too close to the mob group and you'll take some hits. Besides even a full powered FF will only last for 30 seconds. You need to autoattack every 30 seconds for a while to build charges, then whats the point of taking blast cannon? for boss only? Well you'll also need to autoattack against boss to build charge because thats when you specially need a full strength ff.

    02. Charge **** ****, totally **** at early game (when its most hard) and even in late game, with 15 points in it, it doesn't proc so often. In my tests, it rarely procs. Its a kill on effect that might happen and max chance is 10% .. besides its still useless against boss.

    03. Use always Blast Cannon and use basic FF as an extended HP boost, this is probably the best approach, play it like a ranged character. Problem is, a basic no charged FF is by no means can be a replacement for a shield. You would be a potion hog and still its gonna be **** hard surviving.

    I can't see the appeal of two hand weapons except for lower difficulties where surviving is a no issue. As much as I would like to play a cannoneer in HCE, I am not confident enough if its doable.

    P.S. - I have just respeced a lvl 100 engineer and tried a combo of dynamo field + force field for defense and blast cannon for offence. Its not bad. Maxed dynamo builds charge pretty quick and max FF can take a few lvl 105 swamp troll hits at ease. lvl 10 blast cannon does decent job at killing things quickly. I might try this build at HCE. Only downside is you need to be in 11 meter range for dynamo field .. and that is when it max. Meaning its gonna be even harder at early levels.
  • surmisesurmise Posts: 84
    loneranger wrote:

    I don't see what's the obsession with charge for a cannoneer. No charge FF with wazir should be quite viable for a ranged engineer.

    Ever tried to double physical damage with ember reach and tremor? The caveat is you can only use cannon with only physical damage for maximum damage.
  • lonerangerloneranger Posts: 102
    surmise wrote:
    loneranger wrote:

    I don't see what's the obsession with charge for a cannoneer. No charge FF with wazir should be quite viable for a ranged engineer.

    Ever tried to double physical damage with ember reach and tremor? The caveat is you can only use cannon with only physical damage for maximum damage.

    For a cannoneer, damage is not the issue, the issue is survival. Forcefield is pretty weak without any charge at NG0. And while a no charge FF is better than no FF at all, a way to make some charge would surely make this build a lot HCE viable. Using cannon means sacrificing a shield, sacrificing 75% chance to block (avoiding 3 out of 4 or all incoming damage), sacrificing two socket on the shield and additional properties.

    I used to be a wazir fan, it does a solid job for a while but becomes useless pretty fast at later levels when you can buy gear with 400~ HP from town shops.
  • surmisesurmise Posts: 84
    loneranger wrote:

    For a cannoneer, damage is not the issue, the issue is survival. Forcefield is pretty weak without any charge at NG0. And while a no charge FF is better than no FF at all, a way to make some charge would surely make this build a lot HCE viable. Using cannon means sacrificing a shield, sacrificing 75% chance to block (avoiding 3 out of 4 or all incoming damage), sacrificing two socket on the shield and additional properties.

    I used to be a wazir fan, it does a solid job for a while but becomes useless pretty fast at later levels when you can buy gear with 400~ HP from town shops.

    FF is weak in the beginning but once you get near skill level 10 with DR it becomes noticeably useful. The extra HP from FF helps with more sockets for mana and reflect. DR extends whatever extra HP given on the gear by the same percentage, they are not mutually exclusive.
  • lonerangerloneranger Posts: 102
    Yup! The best thing about FF is you can apply it again and again :) I am around level 26 now in Ocean Desert and My cannoneer kicks ****! I am doing fine with non charged FF so far so I'll see how far I can go with this before I put some points in Dynamo.
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