Outlander weak early game?

burgusburgus Posts: 11
edited February 2015 in Outlander Discussions
Hello guys,

I just started a game on Veteran with the Outlander class using dual pistols as my main weapon.
I read some guides for inspiration on how to build and I'm not entirely sure how I'm gonna end up, but I would really like to go for a dual pistol build with focus on STR and DEX.

So now I've played a little while (I think I'm around lvl17 or something like that) and I'm having a real hard time compared to my Engineer and Embermage games.
I need so much longer to kill enemies, I'm extremely weak against multiple foes (lack of aoe), and what strikes me most: it takes me years to destroy shields!
I'm wondering if I doing something wrong. Is it normal that outlander are so weak in the early game? And how can I beat those enemies with shields before I get Venomous Hail?

Note: I do not use Rapid Fire, the skills just seems boring to me. I'm still not sure whether to use Shadowshot or Chaos Burst as an AOE skill. Both seem so unreliable. Shadowshot often fails to chase foes and just hits the wall, and Chaos Burst seems kind of useless in open fields without walls (no ricochet). But if I have to wait until lvl 42 to get Venomous Hail for aoe dmg, I have no idea how to make it there, as I already have a hard time vs multiple enemies. And I'm still wondering how to break those shields faster...

Comments

  • SebiSebi Posts: 63
    Outlander can be hard when first played. But after a while it gets really easy. As for your AOE problem, chaos burst is very very good. The problem is that guns are only good for DPS skills. I suspect you use a lot of auto attack and enemy armor kills guns auto attack even on veteran. Use your skills early game. Chaos burst from close range until you get to higher tiers, after which it becomes really deadly. Also try your best to find the best DPS weapon out there:guns, shotgonne, bow, whatever works at this point. Dual guns are not much help for you right now really unless your offhand has + % attack speed.

    To get an idea of how well outlander works check these two similar builds:

    viewtopic.php?f=42&t=44380

    and

    viewtopic.php?f=42&t=46475

    I suggest you read the guide. If you are not the patient type at least watch the videos, for example:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6dCJHO ... e=youtu.be

    So to summarise:

    1. Don't auto attack (not with guns anyway). Shotgonne hits hard and is AOE, if you like it that is.
    2. Use chaos burst up close for maximum damage until later levels
    3. I do suggest keeping points in rapid fire juts to quickly gain charge (10 points for increased range). Chaos burst is better but only retains charge, it does not gain any. At lvl 42 You will get Venomous Hail which gains charge in an instant, but until then, your life will be **** without a charge gain skill. Also invest in Share the Wealth skill if you didn't.
    4. Use the best weapon you can find for now!!! Don't stick to dual guns unless you just like the look of it.
  • burgusburgus Posts: 11
    Hey thanks for the quick answer :-) I will try your suggestions and see where it gets me.
    What I don't really understand though is the charge problem. It never seemed that my charge would build up too slowly. So is it really that crucial to build it up very quickly?

    edit: in the 2nd guide I read that Chaos Burst blinds enemies. But the skill itself doesn't say anything about blinding. Does this skill apply on hit effects? Does it blind enemies because my shotgun can because of "Shotgonne Mastery"?
  • SebiSebi Posts: 63
    if you are using chaos burst and no rapid fire at all....the only way you can build charge at this point is with auto attack or Poison Glaive, and auto attack is a pain with outlander. You won't be able to do this later. Act 2 will eat you alive. You need to be able to keep your charge bar up constantly. If you don't like rapid fire that much, you can let Poison Glaive at 1 point until you get Venomous Hail. It can work VERY well.

    As for the Blind, it is caused by shotgonne mastery and it is the most powerful crowd control skill in the game. It can blind champions and bosses alike. With venomous Hail you blind instantly and since blind stacks upon itself you get 100% blind, turning the most difficult fight into a trivial one.

    Chaos Burst, Rapid Fire and Venomous Hail, all apply on hit effects, such as blind and stun from shotgonne, - armor, knockback, chance to cast spells such as Glacial Spike or Thunder. So they all benefit from Shotgonne Mastery. Powerful stuff.

    Some advice for mid to late game...Outlanders worst enemies are projectiles. So use items with % reflect projectile, chaos gems with reflect and take the skill shadow mantle as the guides i directed you to suggests, and also 5 points in Repulsion hex for trash mobs that get too close.
  • burgusburgus Posts: 11
    sounds to me like shotgonnes are quite op compared to the other ranged weapons

    edit: general question: do all % of DPS skills generally apply on hit effects that come with the equipped weapon?
  • embermanemberman Posts: 729
    There is a post somewhere that explains which effects %DPS skills apply but I forgot where it is. The general rule of thumb is that most effects apply except for the life and mana drain ones, in most cases.

    Auto-attacking works fine for outlander early game. I have gotten a shooty outlander up to Act 2 on at least 2 occasions in **** Elite mode with mostly auto-attacks. You have to use mostly auto-attacks because you don't have the mana to constantly use your rather mana-inefficient skills (and if you spam mana potions you will run out of them quickly).

    Shotguns are balanced by completely throwing out defense, which makes levelling with a shotgun in Act 2 nearly impossible (on HCE, without farming damage reduction). I prefer shield and pistol. Dual pistol is not something you want to do early game, because the benefit of the extra weapon doesn't matter until late game when you actually get good weapons and enchants. Dual pistols do not do more damage than a single pistol - the advantage is the extra enchant and socket slots. I'd recommend shield and pistol for levelling, with a bow / crossbow on the side for picking things off at range.

    I don't enjoy Rapid Fire either but if you are complaining about enemy armor and refusing to use RF I don't know what to tell you. RF shreds armor. Complaining about armor? Use RF to shred armor and then switch to something that deals more damage. If you really hate RF, Blade Pact is a reasonable replacement. It also reduces armor (not as much as a few stacks of RF), but late game, a rank 15 Blade Pact is awesome (the speed reduction gets really noticeable at higher ranks and makes enemies look like they are slogging through molasses).

    I've never enjoyed Shadowshot much. Part of the reason is it is not AoE. Multi-target is not the same as AoE. AoE hits an area. Shadowshot will always have a maximum number of targets it can hit and the splinters are unreliable. If you are trying to make a sniper build (one-shot one kill) its high damage may be useful but otherwise I tend to ignore it. Chaos Burst is a fantastic AoE skill. If you are trying to use it out in the open you are probably just wasting mana. Don't use it until enemies get close - when they are a safe distance away just plink away with your auto-attacks, and save your mana to blast them in the face when they close in.

    Poison Burst can be an additional source of random free AoE damage. If you kill a bunch of weak enemies quickly you can set off Poison Burst chain reactions if you get lucky.
  • burgusburgus Posts: 11
    Rapid Fire actually turned out to be pretty fun, because it's really useful :-P
    Astonishing how good it works, I'll keep it. But I guess it's better to leave it at lvl1 for a while, as it's only for shredding armor and gaining charge and I don't wanna spend too much mana?
    I just started a new game on elite with outlander, this is gonna be a challenge ;) (I just started playing TL2 on monday)
    Is there some kind of guide on how to level your skills in the early game? (Basically a skilling order) Because as I see it, it doesn't make sense to invest any points in weapon specific skills yet.
    And how does RF's armor reduction work exactly? It says "X armor for Y seconds", but is it X*second or X*bullet...?
  • embermanemberman Posts: 729
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