****.... Survivor Style...

jdhayesjdhayes Posts: 97
edited May 2010 in TL Hardcore Mode
Welcome to Very Hard, ****, Survivor Style.
In this challenge, we return to a simpler, gentler time... That is to say, simpler for the monsters to kill you and you are much gentler with them. We're going to live off the land, foraging for what we need to survie (one hopes) and get closer to nature. Unfortunately closer actually and much of that nature is bent on homicidal intent.
So if there's anyone out there like me who likes the idea of Ironman but hates melee classes, then give this a try. I'm going to simplify the Ironman rules greatly because, honestly, if someone wants to pervert the intent of the rules, they will. So let's keep it basic.
  • You go in with whatever starter equipment your class has. No stopping to chat with the townsfolk.
  • You don't come out.
  • You use what you find (nope, no buying stuff from the in-dungeon merchants).
  • No re-running levels. Just press forward like the rugged survivor you are... an unstoppable kiling machine bent on total dungeon ****. Ater all, what's Ordrak got that you don't? (other than a few billion hit points, breath weapons, and the ability to summon an army of minions every time he sneezes)
Optionally, in case that isn't hard enough, you can avoid the use of summons (which I'm doing on my first character). But I don't want to gimp out possible builds in the alchemy trades.
Let me tell you, playing this way vastly increases the fun of the loot system. I never thought I'd be so happy to see a green rifle or a lecturn. It's great fun to think that the next monster you kill may be the one that drops something to save your life.

So for all you folks that like the ironman concept but want to play a different class, here's the thread for you.

Comments

  • Nice idea, wish you luck :)

    Btw I'm getting impression you only play vanqs - vanq item finder, vanq SV crawler, now vanq survivor, come on give others a try! :) I'm more of a caster/rogue player myself but so far I've found destroyer to be very much fun for me in this game :)
    Alch is very confusing (although summoner is very straightforward) - I find it hard to figure out how to optimize a caster because of the low % damage from weapon and all the different damage types and because I don't know how they stack together.
    Vanq (haven't tried a melee one though) is the one-skill-spam king in this game for me :D
  • Heh, Charity (I call her that because she didn't get any *chuckles*) is down to the T'uatara Caverns and she's level 14. Honestly it's been nip & tuck the whole time. I think she's got basically no armor and no defense. And, for the longest time she was using a 118dps rifle. Happily, right at the end of the Estherian Ruins, she dropped 2 champions, one of them gave her a brighteye sonic and then the next dropped a gravereach bow. I socketed a flow ember into the gravereach and it's a whopping 212dps (*laughs* not exactly my normal **** fair). That bow made the first half of floor 1 in the caverns doable... barely. Then FINALLY, after about 17 dungeon levels, something dropped a heal self 2 spell. That's the first healing she's gotten other than pots and between that and the bow, I'm hopeful she'll make it to level 15.

    Insofar as Vanquishers being the one skill spam king, there is of course a certain amount of truth to that. But honestly, only in the mid-game. Lea's only fighting level 68 mobs and I'm already madly exploring the skill tree looking for ways to stay alive.. and that's with her godly gear. Her goal is to make it to fighting level 100 mobs.

    Honestly, I doubt I'll ever play a destroyer. The character model just makes my eyes hurt and I've never been the melee type (although I adored my werewolf in D2... arrroooo :). But yeah, alchemist is on my list. But right now I am still learning so much about the game content itself and the vanquisher skillset in particular that it'll be a while yet before I start exploring other classes. But, at this point I've played "normal" vanqs, horribly twinked vanqs, and now underpowered ones... each teaches something about skills & techniques.

    Oh, and the survivor thing is GREAT fun. The fact that item drops really matter... even white ones... makes every battle a possible disaster or miracle. You cannot imagine my astonished joy when that gravereach dropped. I wondered when I started this whether being a ranged character would make it simple... just endless run & gun. The answer is a resounding "no". The utter total lack of absorption makes the character paper thin and the normal overwhelming damage of a vanq just plain isn't there in the absense of at least mediocre gear. Even my totally untwinked first character had WAY better stuff than Charity has... bought from the store and enchanted with the town enchanter.
  • is enchanting and using random level maps allowed :D
  • This is not a competition. I didn't want to set this up as an epeen thing. So what is allowed is whatever you want. But the rules I posted say that you don't leave the dungeon and you don't talk to merchants including the ones in the dungeon. So no enchanting if you do it the way I am unless you run across an enchant shrine... which I have not yet. And if you do get an enchant shrine, you'll only get one enchant out of it since you can't rerun levels. Nor can you run random maps since they must be bought from vendors. *chuckles* But man oh man, I cannot tell you how much I wish I could get some enchants on my gear! But that is, afterall, the point of this little excercise. To make things harder. Well, that and the fringe benefit of coming to have a real appreciation for good drops. My main characters have gear which is godly in comparison to that what Charity is wearing... leather armor, some of it white, etc...

    12252009093255364.png

    I mean, just take a look at that newbie armor she's wearing on floor EIGHTEEN of the dungeon. And honestly, that bow, unique or not is not exactly a killer. But still, when stuff drops I can use, I get seriously excited about it.

    Overall, she is current character level 14. She's on Floor 18 of the dungeon where the monsters are level 13. But I'm wondering if she's going to fall behind the level curve and eventually get outleveled by the monsters. That'd make a tough thing even tougher.

    Aside from the rules I posted, I'm also not using fish or summons. My pet fights for me, but only as a base pet. That, of course, means Mreeoooow doesn't fight for long. Every time I hear, "Your pet is hurt." I can't help but think to myself, "Yeah, but so am I and you don't hear me whining about it." That's another thing that I had to relearn... normally, in ****, one does NOT run around wounded. But until I finally got heal self 2, I had to desparately conserve health pots for moments of need. So I fought through 16 levels of the dungeon running around, at times, with 25% health *laughs*. Now that a self heal dropped though, I should be able to be a little more generous healing Mreeoooow with pots.
  • jdhayes wrote:
    Overall, she is current character level 14. She's on Floor 18 of the dungeon where the monsters are level 13. But I'm wondering if she's going to fall behind the level curve and eventually get outleveled by the monsters. That'd make a tough thing even tougher.
    There's a trick for that, tho i won't spoil it unless you ask. ;)
    EHC: Zoolander I/II/III/IV - clvl:9/13/23/18 - Outlander (summoner)
  • @entranced:

    Hey, I'm not above "tricks" so long as they don't mess with the spirit of what I'm trying to accomplish. I've already considered pushing some points into the Adventurer skill. But part of what I'm doing here is the "ever onward" thing so I don't want to go back up levels or repeat content in any way. Go ahead and post your trick and maybe or maybe not I'll find it useful. If not me, then others might.

    As I said above, I was not really trying to create some sort of competition here with standardized rules and all. This thread is mostly about a different way to approach the game than the min/max stuff that I normally do. I find both great fun and still am having a grand time pressing Lea on into the Shadow Vault. But the sheer thrill of seeing loot drops in Survivor Style is also great fun.
  • jdhayes wrote:
    Hey, I'm not above "tricks" so long as they don't mess with the spirit of what I'm trying to accomplish. I've already considered pushing some points into the Adventurer skill.
    That's the trick i was referring to, maxing Adventurer asap. ;)
    EHC: Zoolander I/II/III/IV - clvl:9/13/23/18 - Outlander (summoner)
  • It won't work, my Ironman faced Ordrak at level 28 after maxing Adventurer as soon as it was possible. The biggest advantage of the skill is better healing rates for potions.
  • hippo9hippo9 Posts: 52
    @jdhayes,

    Is an alchemist using Oculi and Tinkertoys allowed?

    Was thinking a couple days ago of a young Alchemist who preferred the Oculi and tinkertoys to the imps that it enraged the cabal. He decide to walk away from the derision of his family and hence be known as the "Prodigal".

    He began his lonely walk into the mines with only his starter equipment. At the entrance, he solemnly handed the portal scrolls to his stoic eldest brother RenVH1 and said "Brother, I will not return until I slay Ordrak or I will die with my Oculi" . He turned and walked resolutely into the awaiting darkness of the mines.

    It was touch and go in the early floors and he was thinking "wtf did I did this for ?" but at the same time reassuring himself that this could work, until the disemboweled phase beast opened the a rift into the unknown. Gathering his pet wolf Scott1 (father of the family's Scott's line of fighting wolves) and his 2 faithful Oculi, he said "We are outnumbered and the horrors beyond that portal would be unimaginable but we will meet them in battle, nonetheless".

    The fighting was brutal but it was thankfully a Lost Chamber and he lived to fight another level.

    PevTmCqs.jpeg

    The battle with the corrupted Brink seemed like forever but finally he brought down the relentless monster to its knees amidst the tears of a mournful Syl.

    The last we heard heard of this young man was that he had cleared Floor 5 of the Tomb of the Awakened of vermin using his white poison wand and bolting his way down to his certain doom.

    8mutJ28C.jpeg
    eacsemifinal2.png
  • hippo9 wrote:
    Is an alchemist using Oculi and Tinkertoys allowed?
    Again, this is not a competition and there is no epeen prize to be won here. Use what puts a smile on your face. The entire point of this little exercise, at least for me anyway, was to take a different road than the min/max road. I wanted to experience the thrill of loot drops rather than the infinite patience of farming gold, gambling, and enchanting.

    The only caution I would say about mods... not a rule mind you... a caution... Is mods that reduce the game to easy mode kind of defeat the purpose. "Easy mode" is in the eyes of the player, not me.
  • hippo9hippo9 Posts: 52
    Thanks, thats good to know. :)

    I have been actually planning something similar since the start of December when running my untwinked Alchemist Summoner on Very Hard (soft core).

    http://forums.runicgames.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=8432#p83991
    Been checking out the builds for Alchemist summoner to run the "marathon" - VHHC run to Ordrak, without mods, no heirlooms, no hand-me-downs or borrowing from other characters, enchanting allowed (anyway, costs are high and it'll break the item at some point), gambling allowed, starts on a clean slate. Just like as if you started an Alchemist Summoner on VHHC on a newly installed Torchlight game.

    It was supposed to be without mods but then it'll be just like running any of my other Summoner runs. But replacing the imps with oculi gives an entirely new approach to the gameplay.

    You are right about "Easy mode" is in the eye of the player. Imps are fast melee fighters though somewhat fragile, but add thorns and you have an excellent combo while Oculi are ranged and to have a skeleton starved summoner with just the golem to tank makes you wish at times that you've gone for the imps. :)
    But for a standard summoner with 10 to 15 skels, the ranged Oculi are an excellent complement to the summoner army.

    Just finished an untwinked vanquisher on very hard softcore and was preparing to run a destroyer in VH(soft) when I chanced upon this thread and decided to do a different kind of "marathon" for my alchemist earlier than planned.

    Having fun with the "Prodigal" and going into the 2nd Esterian portal with my summoner praying hard for a skeleton charm (even level 1 would be very much appreciated). :)
    eacsemifinal2.png
  • I think i'm going to try this. I plan on running it as a vanquisher. My idea is to focus on a build that is less gear dependant. That being said I"m not quite sure if I want to focus more on traps or daggers. I'm not sure how the rouge tree works. It seems less "%DPS" based and more a set amount of damage. I'm strongly considering a blend between the two.

    Suggestions welcome.
  • First run went ok. I made it to level 12 but I fell prey to a phase portal. The fire trap for the vanquisher is great for 1 point early game. After finding a pretty sweet unique mace I decided on a modification to my play. I plan on rebuilding this character but if i find any great uniques or sets for twinking I will port home to stash them. Also I will sell everything I find and pick up my gold. All of the gold I find will go towards enchants for other VHHC toons. I don't have any problems with doing this because I plan on playing some twinked toons.

    I'll make another go when I get home from work tonight.
  • I decided to do this, but do a test run on hard difficulty and run through the Shadow Vault first. I managed to finish four levels and two phase portals, but was killed in a third phase portal because I thought I didn't need a potion that I really, really should have just downed while fighting a champion. Now I know. I'll probably try VHHC through the Shadow Vault sometime soon, because while frustrating that I died and a little tedious running through, it's pretty fun. Man, I had a pretty awesome bow, too...
  • I challenge myself allready to stay in the dungeon as long as possible I will definitly do this with my next toon. I feel like the longer you spend in the dungeon doing stuff i find better loot and more gold, maybe it just seems that way because i never go to town for a break but whatever.
  • Hawk2628Hawk2628 Posts: 14
    jdhayes wrote:
    Heh, Charity (I call her that because she didn't get any *chuckles*) is down to the T'uatara Caverns and she's level 14. Honestly it's been nip & tuck the whole time. I think she's got basically no armor and no defense. And, for the longest time she was using a 118dps rifle. Happily, right at the end of the Estherian Ruins, she dropped 2 champions, one of them gave her a brighteye sonic and then the next dropped a gravereach bow. I socketed a flow ember into the gravereach and it's a whopping 212dps (*laughs* not exactly my normal **** fair). That bow made the first half of floor 1 in the caverns doable... barely. Then FINALLY, after about 17 dungeon levels, something dropped a heal self 2 spell. That's the first healing she's gotten other than pots and between that and the bow, I'm hopeful she'll make it to level 15.

    Insofar as Vanquishers being the one skill spam king, there is of course a certain amount of truth to that. But honestly, only in the mid-game. Lea's only fighting level 68 mobs and I'm already madly exploring the skill tree looking for ways to stay alive.. and that's with her godly gear. Her goal is to make it to fighting level 100 mobs.

    Honestly, I doubt I'll ever play a destroyer. The character model just makes my eyes hurt and I've never been the melee type (although I adored my werewolf in D2... arrroooo :). But yeah, alchemist is on my list. But right now I am still learning so much about the game content itself and the vanquisher skillset in particular that it'll be a while yet before I start exploring other classes. But, at this point I've played "normal" vanqs, horribly twinked vanqs, and now underpowered ones... each teaches something about skills & techniques.

    Oh, and the survivor thing is GREAT fun. The fact that item drops really matter... even white ones... makes every battle a possible disaster or miracle. You cannot imagine my astonished joy when that gravereach dropped. I wondered when I started this whether being a ranged character would make it simple... just endless run & gun. The answer is a resounding "no". The utter total lack of absorption makes the character paper thin and the normal overwhelming damage of a vanq just plain isn't there in the absense of at least mediocre gear. Even my totally untwinked first character had WAY better stuff than Charity has... bought from the store and enchanted with the town enchanter.

    Try playing some of the new classes. Like the ones you can add. Like, download the Class Compatibility pack already!
Sign In or Register to comment.