The misconception about Runics closed servers

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Re: Poential Closed server solution

Postby SaraSophia » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:47 am

Also, even if armor and weapon file were locked, I could simply add an overpowered affix.
Presto! Your "solution" is now useless.
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Re: Poential Closed server solution

Postby Mooks » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:48 am

we kittens now
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Re: The misconception about Runics closed servers

Postby CheesyPeas » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:49 am

What would an overpowered kitten affix be? I'm going to go with 'fluffy'. Although 'adorable' is quite good, too.
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby travisbaldree » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:49 am

So, I'll make a big response.

To start with, I'd dispute the claim that 'virtually all playtime will be spent in endgame'. What does endgame mean to you here? Sitting at max level and killing the same things over and over again?
Because if that's what you mean by endgame, then you are absolutely right, we don't have one. I mean, you can do that. We have random maps and we allow you to NG+ ad-infinitum so that you can whack things to death at level 100 to your heart's content. I don't think that's fun, or something that I want to be doing, so we aren't making a game that focuses on that. We want you to play the game AGAIN. That's the point of randomization. That's why we don't allow full respecs. That's why we built a ridiculous amount of randomized content so that your next playthrough feels fresh, and not like a complete retread. What's the 'endgame' of Nethack?

To be clear, I understand that many people enjoy that. That's fantastic, and there are MANY games that cater to that specific need. But we aren't, and never will be, one of them - nor have we ever pretended to be, or aspired to be.

Official word on PVP - we've had an official word on PVP for ages. Our official word is and has always been, it's sort of there, you can do it, and we allow you to flag regions as forced-PVP if you want in mods, but it isn't the experience we're making. We aren't balancing our skills around killing other players - we're balancing them around killing hordes of monsters. Those are very different things.

Cheating. We have again maintained that we are NOT providing a closed ecosystem. Again, there are other games that do this - and they were willing to shoulder the tradeoffs that you MUST MAKE to provide this. We weren't interested in those tradeoffs or that burden. They were not in keeping with the kind of game we wanted to make. We have never pretended or proposed that we would make a closed game and have been at great pains to make sure that people understand we are NOT providing it. We have endeavored to give you tools to play with only the people you want to, and to eject cheaters from your game and never see them again.

The idea that mods somehow reduce the longevity of a game is something I don't understand at all, and can't think of a single instance of it being true, ever. And EVEN IF IT WERE TRUE I WOULDN'T CARE! I like mods.

If the idea of another person cheating at a game invalidates all of your enjoyment of the game you are playing, I don't even know what to do with that. How does anyone ever enjoy a game of Solitaire? I mean, you can just TURN OVER THE CARDS! The rules are not enforced! How can anyone read a novel? You can just FLIP TO THE END! More to the point - anyone out there in the world could be flipping to the end before you!

If a strictly enforced online environment that prevents any other player from cheating or modifying the files is required for your enjoyment, then this game will NOT be fun for you I guess, and that's ok!

That's not the game we made. I'm all right with that.

We don't need the game to provide unlimited replayability for all time in order to feel that we succeeded at our goals, or for this to be successful for us. We think it's really fun, and super-replayable, and we like it and enjoy playing it. That's enough for us.
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Re: The misconception about Runics closed servers

Postby Pokey » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:49 am

MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERGED!

:D
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Re: The misconception about Runics closed servers

Postby Pokey » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:50 am

CheesyPeas wrote:What would an overpowered kitten affix be? I'm going to go with 'fluffy'. Although 'adorable' is quite good, too.


FUS RO DAH!

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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby ObiRobKenobi » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:52 am

<3 Runic Games forever!
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Pokey » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:55 am

Thanks, Travis. A lovely post.
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby freddy » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:55 am

And EVEN IF IT WERE TRUE I WOULDN'T CARE! I like mods.


Words of the day!
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby CheesyPeas » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:56 am

I hate to be all sycophantic but ...

What's the 'endgame' of Nethack?


I love that you said that.

I don't hate being sycophantic. May I carry your books? Can I make you an omelet?
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Rathmaker » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:57 am

Thank god Runic wants the same thing in a game that I want.

See you all around the campfires in Torchlight :)

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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Snarkyneno » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:57 am

It's pretty sad when even the developers are getting annoyed with all of these "Closed servers are necessary" threads :(
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Re: The misconception about Runics closed servers

Postby SaraSophia » Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:58 am

Actually, I'm thinking of several affixes following the formula:
(item) of the (affix) kitten

Affix could be:
ornery
fluffy
angry
adorable, etc.

They would all have a chance to aoe a stun effect which causes affected monsters to stand in place saying "Oh. How cute."
The various affixes would control time of stun.
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby karame1 » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:00 am

travisbaldree, great post, although you could just write the
it's really fun, and super-replayable, and we like it and enjoy playing it

part!

That's pretty close to what I was trying to say in my previous post: in Diablo2, it was more enjoyable to make another playthrough with unusual build than farming Baal or cows. And now, on top of that, Runic makes this another playthrough more randomized and fun. What not to love about this?
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby ThomasJ » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:00 am

Endgame in an action rpg. Now that is a new one. I could understand wanting endgame in a mmo but action rpg ? No thanks!
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Dejnov » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:03 am

This constant barrage of endgame closed server MMO crap is actually kind of getting annoying. I come on these servers to get my daily dose of TL2 excitement and, while I respect these people's opinions, they just seem to clutter the general discussion forum.


Please Runic Devs, create an endgame/closed server discussion forum and let them whine over there...


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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby TothTheAtlant3an » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:07 am

If a strictly enforced online environment that prevents any other player from cheating or modifying the files is required for your enjoyment, then this game will NOT be fun for you I guess, and that's ok!


QFT
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Howler » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:08 am

It's breathtaking that the OP has managed to offer us so much that is wrong with gaming attitudes today in a single post. I may just have to print this and frame it for posterity.
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Pokey » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:09 am

TothTheAtlant3an wrote:
If a strictly enforced online environment that prevents any other player from cheating or modifying the files is required for your enjoyment, then this game will NOT be fun for you I guess, and that's ok!


QFT


This ^
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Re: The Problem That Will Kill TL2: No Endgame

Postby Rathmaker » Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:10 am

Dejnov wrote:This constant barrage of endgame closed server MMO crap is actually kind of getting annoying. I come on these servers to get my daily dose of TL2 excitement and, while I respect these people's opinions, they just seem to clutter the general discussion forum.


Please Runic Devs, create an endgame/closed server discussion forum and let them whine over there...


Dejnov.


Its just the topic of the month that comes and goes around here all the time. Wait until the game releases, and it will all vanish in thin air, and then we can get a respite until some other topic crops up.

This awesome community has waded these short storms, and we will continue to do so :)

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