Friday Treat 3/16 Potential Loot Drops Analysis

[DarkTails]

Wait... this makes me wonder: Why do white quality items even drop at all?

My guess is so you can enchant them however you want, so you can make a custom weapon. (although, granted it would make more sense for you to actually be able to choose your enchantment not have it semi-randomly assigned)

The really low quality items in D2 were hilarious

[Jerich]

It doesn't look like we will be as inundated with white drops as before anyway. It looks like only about one in five or more normal monsters drops a white or green vendor trash item. That makes it so that you won't have to pick up crap all the time like you did in the first game.

If white items didn't drop, then blue items would be the new green. I could give all my students A's, but then getting an A would cease to have significance for those who earn it.

[Zidders]

No loot left behind!

[DarkTails]

I could give all my students A's, but then getting an A would cease to have significance for those who earn it.

That sounds like a problem with their self-esteem I don't care if everyone in class gets an A whether they earned it or not, it's not like they can fake knowing the lessons taught. It doesn't matter what letter is on your report card, ultimately people [employers] just want someone who knows what they're doing. (and won't steal all the paperclips)

[xani]

It definitely is a chore but I find it to be worthwhile, on that vein of logic why even require gold or any items to drop at all, picking them up and finding them is a chore As Syl said, it makes those epic items much more epic because you have something really terrible to compare them too. Nothing says you *have* to pick up every single white piece either and in fact, I only pick up gear I can use and stuff like potions (unless I'm strapped for gold) and ignore everything else. Not to mention the lowest tier of items will *always* be trash items regardless of the level of it, so if you remove whites the next tier up would become equally useless to you and be nothing but vendor loot.

Well, in TL thanks to pet it's not a lot to do, just few clicks, only downside is "pet downtime", when I play for example path of exile i mostly ignore white loot.

I don't mind white loot dropping, i just want easy way to get rid of it. And that depends on game's "gold level", if I can't do anything with excess gold I dont care but in TL there was OP echanting to spend gold on. Even something like "sell now but for 3/4 of shop's price" so you can either sell by pet, get full price or pet downtime, or have pet always with you but get less gold from it.
Loot drops in aRPGs will never make sense anyway ("this goblin dropped 2h sword ? where did he put it and why he was hitting me with rusty dagger instead?").
Also, anything above white have some kind of random enchants or gem slots so it could potentially be useful (as green/bluedrops can get random rolled in a way it doesn't fit your build and with greens you have more "rolls" to hit combination that's best for you).

Other way to deal with white gear (instead of "sell or ignore") would be some kind of crafting (disenchanting/salvaging) that gives mats from which you can make some randomized item with chance for better q one. Or to make item that can be used on green/blue drops to "reroll" stats, maybe with small chance of boosting quality or adding a gem. I think D3 wanted to do it but they removed that in fear of devaluating crafting materials on AH

[DarkTails]

Anyone else think 450 chests when you're 2/3 of the way through the game is a little too much?...

I take it from those torches and pitchforks you're raising that I'm the only one who thinks so

[Syl]

when I play for example path of exile i mostly ignore white loot.

Loot in Path of Exile is a real problem, there's so much crap I didn't even take a look at it in the end. Whites or blues are kinda crappy if they don't have the right number of linked sockets to put you gems/skills. And because you can craft your whites, you HAVE TO look at all this crap. And then, there are the funky names, you don't know what the item is until you look at it.

It's not a pb in D3 or TL1, because you kinda know that white is crap and you don't have to look at it.

[xani]

Tbh I haven't played a game where white loot would be useful for anything but vendoring, tho some in WoW were funny ( like gray item "broken IWIN button")

Anyone else think 450 chests when you're 2/3 of the way through the game is a little too much?...
I take it from those torches and pitchforks you're raising that I'm the only one who thinks so

Well, those monsters had to guard SOMETHING Tho I don't think they were very happy when last thing they see before dying is adventurer opening chest they defended and saying "meh, that crap isn't even worth vendoring"

[adoomgod]

Darktails, perhaps you are thinking about TL2 in TL1 terms. The size of a single act is bigger than all of TL1. That means 450 chests in 2 acts in TL2 translates to less than 225 chests in all of TL1. Still too much?

The exploration aspect of TL2 also offers a lot more game time, and I think Adam did do the 2 acts in their entirety. Though maybe you did factor this and still felt it was too high a number. To that I think we all need to get our hands on the game and see how it feels before we judge "too much" or "too little."

[Jerich]

I think one thing to remember is that this was still a pre beta build. From my experience in November, I am confident that the Runic team is really good at things like pacing given time. The only reason TL1 had rough spots was that they had to rush it out. If the number of chests doesn't feel right, I'm sure they'll adjust it.

[Graeystone]

Hopefully Sets will be a tad bit harder to get than in TL1. I could always buy the complete Vanquisher's Court Finery Set

You must be very lucky, I found like 3 set pieces of different sets during 2 playthroughs. If anything I'd hope for higher drops for sets (but not from vendor, maybe from gambling) and more sets

Actually the Court Finery was the only one I ever got that lucky. One full set I want is the Midas Set. Always got the Necklace but never the Rings.

One thing I learned from Titan Quest - White Items stay on the ground. Of course it all depends on the game. Take Diablo 2 - if anything non-magical/junk armor/weapons are important for early cash. . .because the shops are all a bunch of effing price gougers! Gheed was the most honest shop owner ever created in that regard. He basically said straight up that he would have no problem gouging customers.

[RizzRustbolt]

Also, whoever wrote the potion drop code is a Jello Biafra fan or a Social Mathematician.

[dreamrider]

Hopefully Sets will be a tad bit harder to get than in TL1. I could always buy the complete Vanquisher's Court Finery Set

You must be very lucky, I found like 3 set pieces of different sets during 2 playthroughs. If anything I'd hope for higher drops for sets (but not from vendor, maybe from gambling) and more sets

Actually the Court Finery was the only one I ever got that lucky. One full set I want is the Midas Set. Always got the Necklace but never the Rings.

One thing I learned from Titan Quest - White Items stay on the ground. Of course it all depends on the game. Take Diablo 2 - if anything non-magical/junk armor/weapons are important for early cash. . .because the shops are all a bunch of effing price gougers! Gheed was the most honest shop owner ever created in that regard. He basically said straight up that he would have no problem gouging customers.

Hmm...I have literally thousands of hours in TL1, knowledge of game techniques that can give me essentially unlimited gold, weapons and gear that allow my best characters to take on lvl 100 monsters with relative safety, and tips that allow me to read the gambler's offerings with about a 70% 'success' rate. For most of that time I have played a side game with myself of loot/set collector.

There are still Sets that I have not completed (not many).

What am I doing wrong? Do I need to be playing in some mode other than VHHC?

My point being, Sets are not too easy in TL1. If anything they are too hard, because it is almost impossible in high-challenge play to accumulate the pieces needed to to make use of any Set's special powers before any given character passes beyond the point of those powers being useful/nice.

I understand that this limitation has been considered at least somewhat in the design of the reward scheme of TL2.

dreamrider

PS - Court Finery is one of the easiest Sets to complete. Talk to me when you have completed one of the 8 piece Sets with a jewelery component.

[Perictione]

Talk to me when you have completed one of the 8 piece Sets with a jewelery component.

Hmmm... I've complete epic versions of Zoromun's and Justice's Convocation (including an epic 'Rifle with No Name' that's part of the epic set), but I've only found 2 bits of Thunderforge and a single item from Chronogear (both sets consist of 6 items)... and at the rate things are going, chances are I'll never complete either of these sets, though I've likely found enough stuff from the former two sets to make several complete sets.

While I'm not sure of the chance to drop set items, I've never seen duplicates of the Chronogear or Thunderforge stuff I have been lucky enough to discover... mind you, it's not all that important: with the exception of the 'Rifle with No Name' and the necklace from the Justice set, I much prefer the unique items I typically equipt my characters with.


- P.

[dreamrider]

Peri,
I actually equip with an eclectic range of (mostly unique) stuff primarily selected and matched for its +% XP affixes, with secondary attention to resistances and Crits.

I have specialist mix'nmatch equipages for shopping (+Barter and -Vendor prices), and for Fishing (er...+Fishing Luck).

However, beyond that I have range of mules with WONDERFUL 'same name' wardrobes.

Standout missing Items are the non-Epic Justice necklace, the Leone's Star necklace, a couple of the wierd magic user Set rings, and, of course, the second Stark Fist that I need to make my Dual-Wielding brace. I went for 2 years without finding even one RWNN of either level; then in the last 4 months I've aquired (primarily through very heavy gambling) 1 standard and 3! Epic.

As you are a markswoman, I will remark that my best rifle is not the RWNN, however. It is an Rare Epic Ribauldequin, enchanted to 15 layers, w/ 2 max Pure Ember embedded. With a maxed out Vanquisher, I can do consistent 140,000+ Ricochet Crits with that sweetheart. I'd rather have a crossbow that shot that fast and hard, but until I manage to figure out how to make one, or luck out with insane enchanting, m sidekick 'Barrett of the Golden BB' will do.

dreamrider

[Perictione]

DR:

Holy smokes! I can see why you're having no problems in the deeper levels of the shadow vault! 140,000DPS? Yoikes! Best I seem to deal out is around 30K. I should take your advice and try out a character that maxs the Ricochet skill in addition to Flechettes. The damage ought to be impressive.

As for the Stark Fist of Removal, I've found 5 or 6 of them, but only 1 epic version. I quite like my pair of Epic Sartan's Ravagers simply because of the 57% increase in attack speed and the 370+ health steal per shot (add Dervish, and I'm snapping off 4-6 shots per second).

Being me, I much prefer installing chaos gems (increasing crit% and attack speed by 4% each gem) and pirate skulls rather than gemstones, but your build definitely sounds interesting!

Thanks for the advice, DR!


- P.

[Zidders]

Whoa. The most dps i've ever done with a character in Torchlight was maybe..I dunno...1500?

Man..I love these kind of games but I sure do suck at them :/

[dreamrider]

The base DPS, before the Ricochet bonus, and the Dexterity mulitplier for 600+ Dex, and the Crit multiplier, is like 3460 or so. Fastest (really fastest, accoring to zekrom's research), at a speed factor of .5.

Most 'Fastest' weapons have a speed factor of .7. That's what makes highly enchanted Ribauldequin's and Jagdshard Bow's so potent. The advantages to building up an Epic Ribauldequin as opposed to a Jadgshard are a) a slight range advantage, and b) it doesn't hurt nearly so much when you disenchant trying to get those rediculous layers of magic.

I'm experimenting with several other types of 'Fastest' rifle (there are no 'Fastest' crossbows - darn!), but so far it's hard to come even close to this weapon potency with any other type of base weapon. I do have a 2030 DPS Epic Arbalest, however, plus a 2561 Epic Organ Gun, and a 2556 STANDARD Ribauldequin!
I have an Epic Blackfist Arquebus with a very high native DPS that has great potential, if it doesn't disenchant early. Stand by.

Someday I will heirloom one of these darlings, and report back.

I sometimes LOL while playing when I am carrying one of the Ribauldequins, and go Dervish VI on a mob in the Black Palace.

dreamrider

[Rusty]

I'd rather have a crossbow that shot that fast and hard, but until I manage to figure out how to make one

Would you like one? I can definitely create one for you. Just let me know what you want and I will whiz one up in my Weapon-o-Matic Transmogrifier.
Also give me a name or else I will name it Dream's Super Duper Awesome Cross Bow of Justice and Deliverance.

Seriously though, I can and will create one for you.

[dreamrider]

Thanks Rusty, truly,...

...but I actually meant "make" in the sense of cleverly and extremely luckily figuring out how to embed/enhance/enchant/or corrupt one up to a 3500 DPS, within the bounds of the game without mods.

I've gotten one to over 2000. I may just have to be patient and extremely lucky enough to get 25 layers of enchantment on the darling, instead of just 15.

dreamrider